Episode 241 – Unstoppable Nonprofit Financial Coach with Dwayne Keys

Unstoppable Mindset

Dwayne Keys grew up in Wilmington Delaware in what he describes as a very low income home with a single mother and two younger sisters. Dwayne constantly talks about how his mom instilled in him high values of ethics and self sufficiency. At the age of 16 his mother told Dwayn that he needed to get a job and begin earning an income to help support the household as well as to be able to buy things he wanted as a growing boy. As Dwayne tells it, he moved from the 2nd smallest state in the country to the smallest one when he moved to Providence Rhode Island at the age of 18 to attend college. By the end of his college career he had obtained a Master’s degree in marketing. He worked at several financial institutions, but in 2017 he decided it was time for a change in his life. He switched careers from working in the profit-making world to working for a nonprofit, Compass Working Capital as a financial coach to educate and assist low income people through a HUD program called Family Self-Sufficiency (FSS). He has risen through the ranks at Compass as you will hear. Dwayne is quite passionate about his work. Over the next five years he hopes to continue to grow at Compass. Also, he plans to run for political office in Providence in 2026. He will tell us all about his plans. I bet he succeeds. About the Guest: Born and raised in Wilmington, Delaware, I grew up in a single-parent household with my mother and 2 younger sisters on my maternal side. As the oldest child and only boy, my mother was determined to instill responsibility and accountability in me from a very young age. As a student, I was very interested in my marketing classes and participated in DECA, which led to me applying to Johnson & Wales University. In moving to Providence, Rhode Island to pursue higher education. While studying to earn my Associate’s degree in Retailing, my Bachelor’s degree in Marketing, and my M.B.A. in International Trade at Johnson & Wales. After deciding to make Providence my permanent home during my first year of graduate school, I made it a point to expand my friends and networks to people outside of my college life by getting involved in many community organizations and activities in line with my passion for economic justice and prosperity. By participating in the Urban League and their Young Professionals, I was able to experience being a community organizer and activist while also being involved in politics at the state and local levels. Over time, my focus has transitioned to that of ending systemic oppression and structural exclusion while also being a proponent of an�-racism and economic opportunity for all. While I remain a community organizer at heart, I’ve participated in decision making bodies with the City of Providence – Equal Pay Task Force, Special Commission to Study a Progressive Tiered Property Tax, Providence Municipal Reparations Commission – as an additional way of achieving equity and inclusion along economic means for Black and Brown residents in the city. This hasn’t been easy working in the for-profit financial services industry, yet under my current employer I’ve found the perfect balance between my vocation and my commitment to community advancement. Ways to connect with Dwayne: LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/dwaynekeys/ Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/dwayne.keys3/ Twitter/X - DKeys_PVD Instagram – dkeyspvd About the Host: Michael Hingson is a New York Times best-selling author, international lecturer, and Chief Vision Officer for accessiBe. Michael, blind since birth, survived the 9/11 attacks with the help of his guide dog Roselle. This story is the subject of his best-selling book, Thunder Dog. Michael gives over 100 presentations around the world each year speaking to influential groups such as Exxon Mobile, AT&T, Federal Express, Scripps College, Rutgers University, Children’s Hospital, and the American Red Cross just to name a few. He is Ambassador for the National Braille Literacy Campaign for the National Federation of the Blind and also serves as Ambassador for the American Humane Association’s 2012 Hero Dog Awards. https://michaelhingson.com https://www.facebook.com/michael.hingson.author.speaker/ https://twitter.com/mhingson https://www.youtube.com/user/mhingson https://www.linkedin.com/in/michaelhingson/ accessiBe Links https://accessibe.com/ https://www.youtube.com/c/accessiBe https://www.linkedin.com/company/accessibe/mycompany/ https://www.facebook.com/accessibe/ Thanks for listening! Thanks so much for listening to our podcast! If you enjoyed this episode and think that others could benefit from listening, please share it using the social media buttons on this page. Do you have some feedback or questions about this episode? Leave a comment in the section below! Subscribe to the podcast If you would like to get automatic updates of new podcast episodes, you can subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts or Stitcher. You can also subscribe in your favorite podcast app. Leave us an Apple Podcasts review Ratings and reviews from our listeners are extremely valuable to us and greatly appreciated. They help our podcast rank higher on Apple Podcasts, which exposes our show to more awesome listeners like you. If you have a minute, please leave an honest review on Apple Podcasts. Transcription Notes:

Michael Hingson ** 00:00 Access Cast and accessiBe Initiative presents Unstoppable Mindset. The podcast where inclusion, diversity and the unexpected meet. Hi, I'm Michael Hingson, Chief Vision Officer for accessiBe and the author of the number one New York Times bestselling book, Thunder dog, the story of a blind man, his guide dog and the triumph of trust. Thanks for joining me on my podcast as we explore our own blinding fears of inclusion unacceptance and our resistance to change. We will discover the idea that no matter the situation, or the people we encounter, our own fears, and prejudices often are our strongest barriers to moving forward. The unstoppable mindset podcast is sponsored by accessiBe, that's a c c e s s i capital B e. Visit www.accessibe.com to learn how you can make your website accessible for persons with disabilities. And to help make the internet fully inclusive by the year 2025. Glad you dropped by we're happy to meet you and to have you here with us. Michael Hingson ** 01:21 Hi, I am your host, Michael Hingson. And you are listening to unstoppable mindset today, we get to chat with Dwayne Keys. And Dwayne has an interesting story. One thing that really attracted me to Dwayne when we first started talking is he pointed out that he moved from the second smallest state in the union to the smallest state in the union. And I want to know more about that. So we'll have to deal with that and who knows what else. Dwayne, welcome to unstoppable mindset. We're really glad you're here. Dwayne Keys ** 01:52 I am so glad to be here with you as well, Michael, and I'm just looking forward to, you know, speaking and you know, for your listeners to hear more about my experiences story. Michael Hingson ** 02:04 Well, let's start then. We do have to get to how come you went from bigger to smaller, but tell us tell us a little bit more about you growing up sort of the early Dwayne, if you will. Yeah, Dwayne Keys ** 02:17 the early to Dwayne. I was born and raised in Wilmington, Delaware. I am, you know, some of the facts that people don't know until they really get to know me, I am the younger of fraternal twins that was born. So I had a twin brother to White who had passed away when I was a year, we were both a year old. So you know, I, you know, I my family expanded with my mother had two other children, my younger sister lover, who was two years younger than me. And then 11 years later, my mother had another addition with my other sister, Vivian. So in terms of growing up, that was my family unit in terms of what I knew, in terms of my father, I always say, I can count the number of memories on one hand of my father, although he did live in the same city. And he also had children as well. Siblings that I really didn't even today don't really know. But knew of and we're aware of. Michael Hingson ** 03:23 So they were in Wilmington. Yeah, Dwayne Keys ** 03:27 we were all in Wilmington. My first few years were obviously live, we're living with my grandparents. And, you know, my mother was a young single mother. You know, in hindsight now, it's very easy to say and speak of that. I grew up in a low income household because my mother always was working full time. Also, part time, she was always supporting us, the family, and there are moments where I can reflect on it, we were financially challenged, but yet, I didn't know it growing up, you wouldn't ever known that just how my mother was determined that we would have a comfortable living environment and that we had we need but it's now knowing when I know it's like, oh, we definitely were poor. Michael Hingson ** 04:16 Yeah. Isn't it interesting how parents keep that from children. And I can appreciate that and understand it because she didn't want you to worry about those kinds of things right. Yeah, Dwayne Keys ** 04:29 I mean, it's you know, it kind of thinking about it like you didn't you can remember there's moments where the electrical turned off or something that disconnected or there was a notice of something. But as I you know, I she was very supportive of me really, she was very direct on getting good grades, anything with less than a C was unacceptable in the house, and then even if you got to see that was still she always emphasized you can always do better But she definitely had a very high expectation of me not only of, you know, doing well in school, staying out of trouble, but also just being more then the lived experience. So, you know, you know, just, you know, questions about going to college she was very big on, I see you going to college, I see you doing these things, I see you doing more than what we knew in terms of Wilmington, Delaware, more than what the life and she would always emphasize that I don't want you to have to work two jobs, I don't want you to have to struggle like this, I want you to be able to have a you know, have an excellent life have a way of life where you can do work, but get compensated for it. So it was always my you go to school to get the good grades to get the degree so that you can get paid well and not have to struggle financially. Michael Hingson ** 05:54 Like she did. Did she say those things to you? Dwayne Keys ** 05:58 Yes, she did. She was as I gotten older, and particularly as I became a teenager. And then as I got to the point where I was able to work, she did emphasize that. So when I turned 16, a month after my 16th birthday, she got me a job working at one of the supermarket that she had worked at as well at that time, that was her second job. And her statement to me was that you are going to now start paying bills in this house, you're going to contribute financially because you're good. And what I didn't realize at that time, but what she was doing was instilling that sense of responsibility. And so she didn't tell him it to me at that time. But years later, she instilled that she was happy that she had made me go to work, because then the concept of me going out earning a living being able to support myself that was instilled early on Michael Hingson ** 06:52 about what's your sister's? Did she do the same thing with him. Dwayne Keys ** 06:57 She actually this, my youngest sister lover, started actually working with she was what 15 1415 years old, because, you know, I there was extra money, I was able to have spending money, do some stuff I was you know, I was able to drive my mother's car because I have my license. And so I think my younger sister saw that and wanted some of that for herself, you know? And so it was, well, if you want to have those things like Dwayne does, well, you should consider getting the job, you know, you have to shoot my mother's wedding, you're like, alright, well, Dwayne's works, that's why he's able to get those things and have those things. And so the idea was, well, I should get a full time get a part time job. And so she started working part time, during summers, and also in school, you know, you know, time restricted, but she was able to find her own part time job to work. And that has been the same thing. Also my younger sister Vivian, with, you know, getting employment where all I would say where we all when we want to accomplish a goal and we want to do something, we find a way to do it. We just do I, we may not have everything planned out or or organized at that moment. But we are very determined people when it comes to accomplishing our goals and getting when we want. And so that sense of determination is in all of us. It just shows in different ways at times. Michael Hingson ** 08:20 Yeah. Well, I appreciate what you're saying. I can't save that growing up, we had such a low income, that we had electricity or anything turned off. But I know we weren't really rich by any standard. And we we had an income that allowed us to sometimes drive to visit relatives and things like that. But we we didn't have a lot of money. And when my parents finally passed, we certainly didn't have a lot of money. They didn't have a lot of money to, to give to my brother and me. But still, I think the same kind of ethic was in what they instilled in us, which was you got to work you got to learn to make your own way. And I think although they didn't say it, probably a little bit more for me than my brother. My parents were told when I was born four months later, it was discovered I was blind that I was gonna that I should be sent to a home for handicapped children because no blind child could ever grow up to a mountain anything and my parents said to the doctors, you're wrong. He can grow up to do whatever he wants. And they really made sure that I grew up with that kind of an attitude. And I certainly have absolutely no regrets with him doing that. Dwayne Keys ** 09:35 Yeah, yeah, absolutely. It's amazing how parents have their plan. They don't always tell you or communicate their plans to you. It's only until even more recently, I'm like okay, now what she said made sense. Now what she did make sense. I didn't understand that at times. And at times. It was frustrating because it did feel like oh gosh, she's controlling Oh, got it. It's never good enough. But then in hindsight, I'm like, everything. She had had a purpose that it's now being fulfilled now, but I can see. Well, Michael Hingson ** 10:08 the other side of that is she may not have had such a well spelled out plan that she really understood all those things. It was just kind of the ethic that was in her. Dwayne Keys ** 10:19 Exact exactly. I agreed. So Michael Hingson ** 10:21 you went off to school and you got a diploma and all that, then did you go to college and what did you do there? Yes, Dwayne Keys ** 10:29 so um, I you know, after completing Brandywine high school, during my senior year of high school, I had been involved in some activities. One was deca, that was the marketing club. And I had participated in the DECA State Conference in Delaware in February, and had won second prize in one of these categories. And lo and behold, Johnson Wales University was there at the conference, and they were handing out brochures, they were, you know, talking about the university and how they offered their, you know, programs in terms of marketing, and then how they had progressed that specialize in advertising, promotion and Fashion and Retail. Sounds exciting? Well, I mean, look at it, you know, it's not gonna hurt to apply. I was debating about what I stay in Delaware, when I go apply to University of Delaware Delaware State, do I stay Do I go? What I found was appealing that Johnson was his curriculum was just, it was not the traditional school. And so it stood out to me that there was more focus, they called themselves back there America's career in a university. So it was appealing to me because it wasn't like, I'm just going to be stuck in where I've been hearing this, this nightmare about people in terms of just going to college, and I have no life, it was more of like, wait a minute, we're going to prepare for you to get that job that you that so desire. So that was very appealing to me in terms of the university. It was also appealing to get out of Delaware. It just it just, you know, I loved my hometown, but I felt that I was stifled there. And I didn't feel so that I could be myself in terms of my ambition, my attitude, the things I aspire to. I saw Wilmington, Delaware. I mean, my mother was saying it's like, it's kind of like a retirement state at times. And, you know, if you want to have an active social life, we will go to Philly Philadelphia, which is like half an hour, 45 minutes away. And it just, he was like, Okay, here's your chance, an opportunity to get away. So I did apply to the school. I did get accepted. what my mother did not know at the time, and I have since revealed I took a secret trip to Providence. High school time join, swim break. during spring break, my mother would took a trip down to Atlanta. And so she was during that year, you know, seeing visited Atlanta, my aunt, her sister had moved, got married and moved down there. And my mother was being told you got to come down to this city, you need to see this, you need to, you know, experience like down here. My mother was falling in love with that city. And during the week when my sister state when my grandparents, I had made a day trip by train to Providence, Rhode Island form, it's in Delaware. When I came here, the mall had just opened up, they were having WaterFire it just felt good. I liked the look and feel of Providence. I liked how it just sounds like yeah, I could be down with this spot. So I was comfortable with coming here, although I never told anyone about that. So most of my family had thought I was just coming to this place not knowing what it was I was coming into when in fact that I had an idea of what I was going to be experiencing. And, you know, I had worked for most of that summer in between graduating from high school and getting ready for college. And then in August, the beginning of August, right before I was due to come to Providence, my mother made a decision. She was moving out to Atlanta, so she and my sisters moved down there first I stayed with my grandparents temporarily. And then my grandparents took me to Providence Rhode Island School instead of dorms. Michael Hingson ** 14:21 So what did mom say when you finally told her about your secret trip? Ah. Dwayne Keys ** 14:28 She did not really get mad. I mean, now when she sees all the stuff that I've been doing, and I've been involved in, I think she accepts it that it was it was divine intervention. It was you know, it was only revealed like I said within the last year or so, so well not much that can be done. But I think she now accepts that. It was meant to be meant to be for me to be in Providence. Hey, mom taught Michael Hingson ** 14:55 you some of the skills you Oh, gosh, yeah. So that's that's still is a great story, though, you, you did what you needed to do, which is certainly a good thing. So you went there. And I gather that you decided to study marketing. Dwayne Keys ** 15:18 Yes, I mean, my associates was in retail because I was looking at the different areas, the different pathways that Johnson was offered. And so the one that caught my eye, which is the one that I was very familiar with was retail retail. And, you know, the initial idea was okay, you can learn about the aspects of running a retail store or retail management. And then at the end of your two years, when you complete your associate's degree, you can decide if you want to continue on with retail for your bachelor's, if you want to change it up. And so I, you know, just created that pathway. When I complete my associate's degree, I decided to move on to get into bachelor's degree in marketing. I was like, I loved I loved at least at that time, I loved retail, but I was like, I didn't want to limit myself to just retail as my education. And that's generally marketing, because then I can transition to any other aspects of marketing, FYI, so decided in the future. Michael Hingson ** 16:19 And so you went off and you got your, your Bachelor's in marketing? Correct? Correct. Correct. So when did you graduate with that? Dwayne Keys ** 16:27 I graduated my bachelor's degree in 2003, and 2001. Michael Hingson ** 16:33 All right. So they offered an associate's degree at Johnson wells. Correct. Dwayne Keys ** 16:37 They believe they still do again, it's been 20 something years. So I'm not sure what has changed the curriculum. But that was the pathway at the time. Well, cool. Michael Hingson ** 16:45 So you, you did that? And did you go get any kind of advanced degree after the bachelors? Or did you just stop there? No, I Dwayne Keys ** 16:55 had decided to continue on with Johnson law. So my graduate degree, at that time there was this debate, do you get your master's degree get an MBA male, I had took along with myself, and I was saying, I don't want to have to come back to school later on. I did not. I, like many other people thought, okay, college is done, I'm never gonna have to do a study. And again, obviously, I've seen that not to be the case, I can see you to study even in my career. But at that time, I was like, you know, what would make sense. And that was like, I rather get that degree now. Get it out of the way you'll have it and your educational levels, and they you will focus on your professional experience so that when the time comes, and that is a preferred or required education level, I would have already had that in my possession. I didn't have to worry about going back study and be in a position where I'm working full time ever in a career having kids with doing that. So my aspect was, you're still in study mode, you can still take the test easily, you still can do all those things. Go ahead and do it right now. Michael Hingson ** 18:03 Yeah, I hear you. I decided, when I got my bachelor's to continue on as well. I just thought that it was probably better to to, to get most of the schooling done. The formal schooling at least done all at once. I never had the attitude that I wouldn't go off and continue to learn and do other things. But as far as formal college, I just did it all at once. And I enjoyed it and have no regrets about doing that. Yes, yeah. So when did you graduate with your bachelor's or your masters? Dwayne Keys ** 18:38 I completed and graduated in 2005. Okay, Michael Hingson ** 18:42 and then what did you go do? Dwayne Keys ** 18:45 So, um, one of the things that's also amazing and interesting is that I had always been working full time. For most of my college life. I think the first year in my freshman year I lived on campus, I did work study, I may have taken a job here and there. But the second year, I lived off campus and I hadn't lived off campus ever since. And the second year, you know, my mother had a very honest conversation with me when she was very clear, I can only pay your rents have you been paying rent just for this this year, your sophomore year? And are you on your own? You're gonna have to find a way to pay for your bills. I did have some support from my grandparents. But living with my grandparents in between my school breaks was definitely a challenge. My grandparents were Pentecostal who would you describe is conservative, traditional in terms of their outlook on life? And, and then in terms of, you know, how you should be living in life. But then also, one of the things I I really had a challenge for, for them is the distance a country All. And so anyone who knows me, I'm one of which I definitely am for making my own decisions supporting you in what you want to do, regardless of how I may think about it. But I, I had came up against this experience that because I was being supported financially, that also meant that I needed to do what they said. And that was everything from if I even read a book, I remember reading this book on Islam. And it wasn't that I was thinking about converting, I just wanted to learn more about the religion, the culture, the people. And I can remember her seeing that book, looking at it with the stain, and wondering why we're looking at that. And I didn't need to bother myself with such things. And so it's that type of limitation that I have a problem with. And I was really determined that no one's not going to do that. But at that time, you know, you're 1819 years old, you're trying to figure out this word, they are your grandparents be as respectful as you can. But to kind of sum it up, there were mountain building conflicts that happen. And Christmas Break in 2000. I came down for a few days, and I was like, Okay, I need to get back to Providence, I need to get my life in order, I need to get the shop, I need to get things settled. And my grandfather wanted me to stay longer. And I originally thought we were going to take a trip down to Atlanta to see my mother and my sisters. That was the reason for me coming down. And when that didn't happen, I said, well, I need to get back up to Providence and get this all sorted out. And my grandfather being an upset about that. I had asked my grandmother for some money as I as she had promised. And she wrote a check to me, I want to say was like 250 $300. And he said to me that last Yvette Shepherd their chairs, because that's the last money you get in? Don't you ask for anything else ever again. And I said, Okay. And he took me to the bus station. And I got on my bus back to Providence, Rhode Island, and had to just really work on what were my next steps. So between January and March, I struggled to find a job. And there were days where I didn't eat, there were days where I was behind the bills, there were days I almost, if he was was threatened with eviction, but I eventually got a full time job working for one of the department stores Nordstrom. And that was the pathway on working full time. So really ever since before right around, I turned to age 20, I've always worked full time in my field. And so after doing these different jobs, working in retail working for the school, working in the PR office, I decided that I needed to do something that was different, I needed to do a sales job. And long Behold, I got my job as a financial advisor trainee with Morgan Stanley, and that began my pathway into financial services. Michael Hingson ** 22:52 So were you doing Morgan Stanley while you were still in school? Dwayne Keys ** 22:55 Yes, I had gotten that job in April. Yeah, April of 2004, at the end of my first year of grad school. And so in order to keep that job, you have to pass your series seven license. So my first three months, were just studying for that exam, which I, you know, had passed incredibly fast and was grateful, and then had to get additional licenses. But yes, while I was completing my grad school studies, I was doing those license studying for those licenses. And again, working full time and also taking classes in the evening. Series Michael Hingson ** 23:30 seven is not a trivial thing to get a license for. Um, Dwayne Keys ** 23:35 and, you know, I can say that now, but we get jobs on the line, because I was like, Michael Hingson ** 23:39 Oh, sure. The incident was there. Dwayne Keys ** 23:42 We want to do so. Now. I was like, Okay, I knew what I did with the practice exams and retaining information. Absolutely. But at the time, that was that was really a major mental hurdle. Oh, Michael Hingson ** 23:55 yeah. So McCobb that's my point. It isn't. It isn't trivial to do. Yeah. So. So anyway, you did that? And when you got your masters and what did you do? Were you working for Morgan Stanley then or what? I Dwayne Keys ** 24:10 was still working for Morgan Stanley. You gotta remember, this is 2004 2005. So the mindset was, even if you're 20 something years old, or, uh, you know, you, you need to meet sales goals, you need to bring in business, the culture wishes. Now, we will call toxic. You know, again, this is language and words you didn't know about it. But this is a very, at that time, very cutthroat industry. And one in which I just it's like, you know what, I'm not going to be able to thrive here. I'm not going to be to meet the sales goals. So I went to another advisory firm called strategic point that was local nearby. I was there as an advisory associate for about a year. And then I was able to get a job in a call center with Bank of America. Bank of America had just bought fleet. And they were converting all of fleet banks, departments into Bank of America and so fleet on Quicken, Riley and Quicken Riley was becoming Bank of America investment services. That's B, A and C. And so I had gotten that job as an investor. As a investment specialist. That's what they call this. And I was with them for almost five years. So I worked during the 2008, you know, the 2006, market crash and 2007 2008. Financial crisis and in that following Great Recession, which I say for Rhode Island, that recession actually never went away, which is still here in some shape or form. So Michael Hingson ** 25:43 you say you were a BFA? What about a year? Oh, Dwayne Keys ** 25:48 actually, almost five years, I suppose. Yeah, I will stay as a investment specialist. I had been moved to the sales gates, I was, you know, opening up accounts online, I did you know, what they call priority service associate or trading gate. So I did every type of securities trade for self employment accounts that you could think about stocks, bonds, mutual funds, options. I was on our Platinum worker services, which was the high net worth trading gates. And then I was promoted to senior vessel specialist or a team leader. So I was one step below being a team manager. And then I also had to get the Series Nine and the 10, which was the supervisors licenses. So I did do that for at least about, you know, I guess, almost five years, how, when Bank of America bought Merrill Lynch, there was the conversion of the companies and Merrill Lynch was coming in with its own, you know, ways of how he ran business. And I think by that time, I had gotten to a point where I was in the call center. And I was like, Yeah, I think it's time to get back into being client facing but not necessarily leaving the financial services world. But I also wasn't desiring becoming a financial advisor, again, like I had been before. And so I came across this role of what they call a licensed banker. So someone who works at a bank, who just happens to have the investment licenses that they can be a connection between the financial planners and financial consultants, but also still being a banker and retail branch and sovereign bank, we now know what a Santander but back then was still called Sovereign was hiring for this license banker role, and Pathak kid, and I had applied for that job and got accepted. And I was with them for almost like two and a half years, aspire to be an assistant manager. And Sunday air when they took over for sovereign, they took away the assistant manager role. So you just there was no way to build up to become an assistant manager or to become a branch manager, it was this, you need to meet your sales goals. Just keep doing what you're doing, but no type of development, no type of mentoring. And, again, that just wasn't gonna do it for me. So another local bank, Baker, I was hired from the system manager I interviewed applied for him interviewed for that role got accepted, and was an assistant manager for two of their branches and was there for almost three years. And then I got cursed back to coming back to South Sudan when they created the premier client manager group, which was a new department that was supposed to be a new way of remote banking, supporting clients remotely, instead of run a branch. And that department was in place for two years. And in May of 2017, they announced that they were going to close that department. And as they did, I had evaluated what should I do? What's my next move? I was applying to other different roles at the bank and other different financial institutions and wasn't getting anywhere back. And I just something said, why don't you check out some nonprofit jobs. I had always served on different nonprofit boards and was part of different, you know, community events when it came to economic justice. And I was like, let me check those out. And I came across the job posting in Brown University Square center for our financial coach. And I'm just learning more about this nonprofit organization called compass and their focus on families with low incomes and subsidized housing. Michael Hingson ** 29:31 So what exactly does compass do? So Dwayne Keys ** 29:34 compass was basically providing financial coaching to families who were in what's called the Family self sufficiency program, or FSS for short. And so that is a program that is a HUD program, which your housing provider either like public housing authorities or private multifamily owners can offer to residents To have a section eight voucher. And so compass provides program management to those programs while also the financial coaching in that time, compass was moving forward with one of their one of the fall partners, power preservation affordable housing on launching FSS in the name, you know, FSS at six different locations in New England. So this is the first time that FSS is being offered to multifamily properties. And it only been public housing authorities that could offer FSS and just for people to know what this program allows us that in the family self sufficiency program, participant is able to save rent increases, that happened as a result of increases in earned income. So when your income earned income goes up, your rent goes up. But what happens is the difference between what your rent was when you first started the program versus where it is when you have increases in your earned income, that rent increase is put away in a savings account for you about the housing authority. And there's a five year plus program that a participant can be enrolled in. Michael Hingson ** 31:10 So what do you do in your day to day job than what compass? So you went to compass in 2017? And you're still there? Right? I am still there. Six years? Yeah. Dwayne Keys ** 31:21 I mean, so you can say, well, the wall has evolved. Again, I joined as a financial coach, and I've been a senior financial coach. So as a financial coach, I was working with one on one with clients and my portfolio. Meeting with them, we have minimum required times that we're supposed to work with, but it's really supporting them in achieving their financial goals. And I described how I look at financial coaching is, we're in a car, the client is the driver, I'm in the passenger seat. I'm helping with navigation, I'm giving information on what could happen to where, where, what are you going to experience, if you turn left, if you go right, if you go backwards or forwards with the mindset that we're supporting the client, and they'll be making their own decision as to where they want to go on this financial journey. And the emphasis is on asset building my client, you know, people take to move from being asset poor, to asset secure and a public benefit system, you always hear about an emphasis on income and income is important. Yet we do know that having assets having savings for emergencies to be able to buy, you know jumping around the hall to be able to have an asset such as owning your own business, you know, owning your own home having money for retirement, just emergency savings, we know that this is key to families and to people's, you know, success. And so I had started off again, working directly with families one on one. And as a senior coach, I worked on other special projects and supporting compasses of mission. The last three years I was a coaching manager, I was leading a team for up to four financial coaches. We're making sure that we're providing that high quality financial coaching that I did as a coach, and which I was still doing and then more recently, I was promoted to director of programs for our multifamily partnerships. So I mail overseeing the team of coaching managers, program managers who are overseeing coaches and outreach specialists, Sunday making sure they're having effective program management, getting high quality financial coaching, and I'm working with six different multifamily partners on strategies for expanding FSS scaling the FSS program. Michael Hingson ** 33:35 So how does compass make money? I mean, are they do they get it from funding? Do they get it from the investments that you help people acquire or what? Okay, Dwayne Keys ** 33:45 so essentially, I combination is, obviously philanthropy. We do do a number of fundraising, but you know, foundations definitely do help. We do get paid for running these programs for the housing partner. So that's the additional source of income as well. Really funded program. So the federal funding it Yes, it is. So, more recently, it used to be the only public housing authorities could get HUD funding to fund these positions to fund the work of FSS now, multifamily owners can do so depending upon if you receive an award from HUD so there is some federal funding involved you also make it the housing provider that we work with this their own sources of funding that they used to pay compass with and then I'll put the bulk of our money that we do is philanthropic Michael Hingson ** 34:35 Okay. It seems to me and I have to go look I know we've had a somebody else from campus elsewhere on unstoppable mindset, but it's been a long time so I'm gonna have to go back and look, but I know it was it was fascinating to hear what what compass did and and what all you guys are doing. So for you, though, having heard about your upbringing, and so on, and heard about how your life has evolved over time? What would you say your passion and areas of focus in your life is or are? So Dwayne Keys ** 35:12 the role is where I'm really fulfilling is how do we help families rise up out of poverty, you know how to set one a panel discussion a few weeks ago, which was the witness that world with no poverty where people are not having to rely on this mindset of just pull yourself up from your bootstraps. But wait a minute, we're really giving people the financial education that they need. And I say that financial education, not financial literacy, because I can't stand someone thinking, you know, that we're the financial literacy, people are illiterate, they just may not have the education that you have in terms of this area of personal finance. But also having the assets, the cash, the capital to do what it is that you need to do, is very significant. I appreciate what I've seen some of my client experiences. In the last, particularly at the beginning of the pandemic, like that first year of the pandemic, I had two clients who were able to buy that house. So even in the issue of this, the scary situation of COVID have this uncertainty with the economics of what's happening with our country and all that was going on, I still have clients who are able to persevere who are able to move forward and achieve their goals of homeownership, or, you know, other goals, or just having the money to be able to survive and emergency. And it was also a unique time, because many some of my clients had to then pivot when they had lost their jobs temporarily. They use that time to think about should I go back to school? Should I you know, focus on being self employed? What does that look like in terms of starting my own business? So it definitely opened up opportunities for people to be creative, how do we still thrive and be able to accomplish our next steps in our goals, in spite of all the uncertainty that we're still facing that we still face today? But for me, too, as I said, it's who better to help you support you in this and navigating through these financial systems and the experiences that someone who grew up with it and also experienced it themselves? You know, I kind of joke, you know, joke here and there. But I was like, Who better to help people to death collection that someone who had a debt collection who had to endure that experience and go through it? Yeah, Michael Hingson ** 37:25 you are very fortunate that you had a mother who helped you through it by requiring you to do the things that you did. And so and you also have obviously had to discover some things on your own as well. But you did that, which gives you the skills now to do what you're doing, which is teaching others? Yes, Dwayne Keys ** 37:47 yes, absolutely. Absolutely. Michael Hingson ** 37:51 Go ahead. Yep. So all right, go ahead. Go ahead. I Dwayne Keys ** 37:55 was gonna say, you know, even at Compass, you know, there's been a lot more that I've had to learn, because even though that's what we do, you know, my current role, I've had to learn project management, program management B, what does it mean to run a nonprofit? You know, so there's been quite a number, quite an education I've continued to receive even there in terms of that arena, while at the same time, you know, following up with just making sure that we're providing the high quality financial coaching. Michael Hingson ** 38:22 So you, you work with people who are probably coming to you with a lot of fear and uncertainty in their lives, right? Correct. Correct? How do you help them overcome fear? What do you do to help them overcome fear and not be so daunted if you will, or blinded by having all this fear in their lives? Because of all the things that have happened to them? Yeah, Dwayne Keys ** 38:47 I mean, one of the the initial steps with all of our training is you have to build trust with the clients. And it's very hard, because you have to remember, they've experienced systems and organizations and peoples in the past, who may not have treated them well, or they may have not had a best experience. So really, establishing building that trust is key. The next step is understanding their journey, their story, what they what have they done, and also celebrating successes that they've achieved on their own, because we never want to disconnect or distort this, dismiss what someone has achieved. But it's also then having to get back to what is it that you want to accomplish, and when you want to do and, again, we're going to go at your pace. So I've had some clients that they come in, I know they want to buy their house, they know what they need to do they know what they need to work on. Great. We're gonna go with you on that. And then I've had some clients who will say, You know what, I actually don't know what I want to do. I want to start I further say, you know, I want to start my own business. I don't know what that is, okay, well, then we're going to go on this pathway, and then on at this pace, so that we can focus on that. And again, we're going to be flexible and adaptable. So if right now, there's a goal that you'd be focusing on but then something that's happened to you you got to prioritize The other thing that we prioritize that other thing I will say is that this is your journey, this is your financial coach. And this is not my journey, you know, my appointment, and I'm gonna tell you what you need to do, you set the tone of where we're going to focus on. And I'm here to make sure you have the information, the resources, and the support that you that you need to receive in this program. And I think one of the main key things I have been able to do is help people recognize their own successes, people may be just doing things because they needed to do it. Or they may experience a situation where they think it's a failure, when actuality is success, and what are the things which makes him so minor, but I think it's majors, clients work on building up an emergency fund, then they put away their savings, they reach that goal, and then next, an emergency happens. And then they have to use that money. And they're saying, I'm so depressed, because yeah, this happened with the car, this happened with this thing. And I had to use it. And I'm like, great, because that's what an emergency fund is for. That was exactly, so think about it. By using having that money, you didn't have to worry about using credit cards using credit using any type of predatory lending, you didn't have to borrow, you didn't have to do any of the things that would have gave you additional stress, you had the money right there. That's excellent. That's the goal that was accomplished, you accomplished your goal. So just thinking about those things about stuff, which people may feel as though that's not really a major accomplishment. And actually is when you think about how you're trying to achieve financial security and success in your life, Michael Hingson ** 41:32 trying to bring some perspective back to people because they, they really don't necessarily see what really happened. I mean, you, you guided them, they did stuff. But until something happens that causes them, for example, to use that emergency fund. And then you have to remind them of what that means, then and only then do they really internalize what happened. Yeah, if you had to really give us one story, that was just a great success story, what would it be? Dwayne Keys ** 42:04 One story was one of my clients who ended up she had saved I'm gonna say up to $30,000 in the program. But even up to that moment where she was completing the program, she still had doubts about if she was going to get that money. And we were she, she had been, you know, increasing our income had been saving. But her budget was becoming very challenged with affording both the rent increase, and the other bills because she also had a car payment. And she had gotten this car loan in order to be able to get to work. But it was causing this this great challenge in her budget. And so we just asked the question, it was like, you know, you're struggling with this payment, you're struggling with being able to meet other obligations, when it makes sense to take some of that money that you've already saved, pay off that car loan. And then by doing that, that helps you get, you know, you'd be able to meet all the obligations and get budget you're able to save on your own, you won't have to worry about that. That item being on your credit, you know, being an obligation, the more you own it outright, you can even maybe adjust your insurance rates, you have to worry about full coverage and save some money that way. What about that, and she was like, You know what, let's do that. And we have put the request in the check arrived two weeks later. And even when she's coming there, she's looking with the tears and running up her eyes because she's like, this is really she's I can't believe this is really happening. You know, because you hear about it, you talk about it, you say this is going to happen for her to actually see that that's happening, we're going to do that right now. And that's why it wasn't just it was one less thing she had to worry about. It was like, think about all the stuff she's not going to be able to do now that that goal, you know, being able to pay down that debt, pay off that debt entirely, not have to worry about that and have a car and her own right that she owns was the phenomenal. So just I always talk about like, even to that moment to see that, oh, this is this is really I'm really going to accomplish this goal, this is really going to happen, I'm really going to be able to say that I did this, that memory still stays in my mind, just but the reaction of you know, the opposite that very moment of the cheque being placed in your hand there was this disbelief that this is really a true real true program to actually exist and helps people. Yeah. Michael Hingson ** 44:26 And they wouldn't have had access to those resources in any other way if you weren't there to advise them. Dwayne Keys ** 44:32 Correct. Exactly. Exactly. Michael Hingson ** 44:36 Well, you've been doing this now for quite a while. What do you see yourself doing in five years? Dwayne Keys ** 44:43 So that you're singing about you know, as we've been talking about, what is the next pathway and I have put that out there? So I do see myself as an executive at Compass we have different levels. You have all staff obviously individual contributor manager level director level Which I'm at now. And I just says, I can see myself as an executive, you know, and I look at my own pathway. I'm like, you know, things could change. Compass has expanded. When I first started, the organization was 25 people. We're now at above 70. So you know, this growth money in the company, where I also see myself is that, as I said to you, you know, I've always done this volunteer work in terms of advocacy, special events, work, doing things with different nonprofits, and I've come to be a specialist when it came to like community engagement strategies when it comes to people of color, particularly in this part of Providence, just being a special advisor, facilitating meetings. And what I've done is I've been able to wrap up all those of the special projects and what I've done in terms of workshops and teaching, and things outside of campus, and to my own sole proprietorship, Deacy solution, which I've had in place since 2015. But really, this past year was really one in which I've done a number of projects. So just being like a business coach and a workshop instructor to participants who are looking to design, you know, set up their own design business and supporting them in terms of business developments, and how did you set up a business bank account and have you set up your own business to be able to, you know, launch as a business entity. That's been fulfilling, but a number of other projects have been doing. And then obviously, I aspire to hold elected office, I did run for state rep in 2018. And I will be pursuing running for our local city council races in 2026. Michael Hingson ** 46:45 Oh, not till 2026. Every four Dwayne Keys ** 46:49 years. So my counsel first and just read in one her third, third term in 2022. But she's term limited, the more currently I've been supporting her ever since she first ran in 2014. Definitely have been a, you know, great admirer of the work that she's done with our area. And in a way I want to be able to continue which he had started in our terms. So you know, it's been something we're we've been openly discussing, but I've been very firm to it. Yes, I am running in 2026. I do have my campaign account open, I do have things are in place. And as we get closer to that date, more TOCOM? Michael Hingson ** 47:29 Well, I would only say the other side of that is that at least her term limits are causing her not to be able to run, then you won't be able to run against her, which is a good thing. Dwayne Keys ** 47:38 Correct. You know, Michael Hingson ** 47:41 good to have friends, you know? Yeah, Dwayne Keys ** 47:43 yeah. I mean, people have asked that question, why don't you run? And I said, No, no, no, I made it very clear that I do support our incumbent, I definitely do admire her work and what she's done. And so no, I was not going to challenge her. But I said the moment she said that she was done, I'm running. Michael Hingson ** 47:58 Well, that's fair. In a lot of ways. So what what issues are there in your surrounding community? And I guess I would say overall, for all of us, that we need to be a little bit more aware of things that you want listeners to know about that they ought to deal with. Dwayne Keys ** 48:17 Yeah, I mean, this is also reflecting that up, you know, the last seven and a half years, I was the chairperson of the South Providence neighborhood association. So that was a nonprofit that was launched in 2015, when, you know, the council person had just gotten office. And there was the desire for us to have a group a body a place to come, where we can get information and talk as a community neighbors, you know, neighbors, what was going on the neighborhood, what's impacting us, and how do we move forward? In this experience, I will say there's a number of things that are going on. One has to deal with zoning and urban planning issues. You know, with Providence, we have huge issues when it comes to housing design. We have a situation where I like it, you know, I have to say this, I use just words. You still have segregation and redlining practices embedded in how we have housing development housing projects that are being done. We definitely have this issue of housing affordability, which is across the nation, but you know, it here in Providence, we have displacement that's happening where a lot of residents, you know, low to moderate income, primarily, black and brown residents have had to move out or move elsewhere. And because they haven't been able to afford the high cost of prices, you know, they're not able to the wages aren't keeping up with the prices of inflation and the housing costs of class in Providence, unlike some other cities, where they require housing developments to include units include price points for low to moderate income Up. in Providence, we're okay with people who want high luxury housing development just behind luxury development, know what the subsidies. So it's also creating these divisions in my view where we're not. We're not providing opportunity for families, individuals, those from different walks of life to be living in all parts of Providence, it's almost as if, oh, this price point, you only have this type of housing and this one part of the city or that part of the city, and it's perpetuating that. Another thing has to also deal with the issue of taxation, you know, Providence, we are a college town, but literally half of our properties or either owned by colleges and universities or by governments, because we are the capital city, or we're an island. So we've definitely had financial issues, when it comes to our pensions. When it comes to our viability, there was this huge major issue between what we call the pilot program payment and low taxes with the universities, colleges, universities, many residents and think that the universities are paying more than they should. And we do have a big hospital community in my part of the neighborhood in which there's been debates about that community not paying their share, and also fears that that hospital community will take more land in the neighborhood for their, their buildings, their parking lots. So there's a history of how do urban renewal eminent domain homes were take, you know, were bought, and people had to move out of the neighborhood for the expansion of the hospital community. And you have many residents will still talk about that today, Michael Hingson ** 51:37 without any kinds of issues that you might be seeing or encountering regarding persons with disabilities, which is, you know, usually a large minority that people don't talk about. Dwayne Keys ** 51:49 So one of the things that has already come up in terms of the city where I already said, I'm like, we are not ABA compliant, when it comes to our sidewalks, when it comes to people with wheelchairs, a major issue that happens and this is where we're talking about, you talk, think about something as simple as shoveling the sidewalks during the wintertime. And what I've seen, you've had people but in particularly those people who have mobility issues having to walk in the street, because that person or that company or organization did not shovel the sidewalk. So we have a public safety issue, which is every one that I find with people with disability disabilities, for those who have a mobility issue, that is a major crisis that is going on. And then the main thing also with Rhode Island, and particularly Providence, we have old housing stock. So there's a number of people who may again, because of mobility issues, they can't get to the third, second or third floor. So they are limited, but housing. So we have a number of people and actually one of my good friends, colleagues Titi Podesta, and she was like She's someone who has mobility issues, she was speaking about this, you know, there's housing, there's units, there's places that she can't go, because it's not accessible. So that is one thing that I definitely see here that you don't think about until it's time to have the activity or until it's time to do something and that person candidate get in and she made a good point. She was like, I bet you the majority of the folks if I was if you were to have an event or something that your house will not be able to come to your house? And I'm like, no, because I'm on the third floor, no elevator, no other way for you to get off to the third gift to me. Michael Hingson ** 53:25 So yeah. How do you deal with that? Dwayne Keys ** 53:27 So I mean, one of the things we have to do is we talk about infrastructure, we have to invest and we upgrade or design the housing a way that is accessible for people to be able to get into the dwellings. And then you also have to deal with this practice of preservation and look and feel and care, because we are an old historic New England town. Absolutely. And we to have nice gorgeous Victorian houses and everything else. And at the same time, we have this housing crisis, people need to use that space. How do you balance look and feel and character and uniqueness with this need of mobility of access? Michael Hingson ** 54:12 Well, to go another direction, though, which in some senses ought to be a whole lot easier to address. So what about things like? Are the city websites accessible? What are you What is the city doing to make information readily available? website accessibility across the board and so on? Michael, Dwayne Keys ** 54:29 the website accessibility, it's not even accessible to those who can say so we have a we have a whole issue, Michael Hingson ** 54:37 good political answer, no information really works. Dwayne Keys ** 54:42 So you have people who struggle to just get information in general from the city at times. And so we're, you know, so you bring up a very good point. It's not even at the forefront, not because it's not, it's not important. It's more of like we're just struggling to get the basics of everyone just know what's going on. Er yet. Michael Hingson ** 55:01 One of the things that I talk about from time to time in speeches that I give as well, as I've mentioned a few times on this podcast is, when people talk about diversity, they never really talk about disabilities, because we're not part of the conversation, we're not part of the discussion. And that's what really needs to change until people recognize that diversity. If it's going to truly be diversity needs to include everyone, then that's not going to change. And so I oftentimes have discussions with people about inclusion as opposed to diversity because they say, Well, we're, we're working on being inclusive, but you're not inclusive, well, but we're partially inclusive, Nope, doesn't work. You either are inclusive, or you're not. And if you're inclusive, it's a mindset. And if you are inclusive, then you're going to be dealing with disabilities and so on. It's unfortunate that we're not there yet. As I said, we don't really make disabilities part of the conversation. But I know what you're saying about housing and so on, you know, my, my wife used to watch when she was alive, a lot of the shows on house building and all the people who come and renovate homes and all that sort of stuff, they would not invariably do anything, to think far enough ahead that if somebody had a house, and they were renovating it, that they might make it accessible for the next person who might buy that house. And so none of the people that really deal with all the house stuff on TV, deal with it, either. The only time it ever comes up is if you happen to have somebody in a wheelchair or whatever it is, it is unfortunate, we're not part of the conversation. Yeah, Dwayne Keys ** 56:42 and I think that goes into this other piece, too, is equity when it comes to design and decision making. So when we're making the decision of what gets done, or how it gets done, or do we have everybody who needs to be included, not just in that conversation, but agreeing that this is the way that this is going to go. And that is very, that is lacking in many particular cases, I see it both not just in terms of like accessibility, but even with those who have a disability, who are also receiving public benefits, SSDI or SSI. In some cases, I have seen that where there's limitations when it's time to transition for them being able to go back to work and be able to earn a living, you see that limitation there in terms of you're limited to how many hours that notching it, how many hours how much you can earn in that particular time period. Yeah, if you can lose this benefit, you lose that benefit. And so that was one of the things to your point, when I first came to Compass, we had always up to that point at work with more public housing authority clients, who see almost all of them very rare that you came across someone who had a disability who was receiving one of those benefits. And when I came into, you know, compass, I encountered a number of people who enrolled, who had SSI SSDI benefits, particular SSI, who wanted to go back to work, but he had all these limitations and how he could save how they can earn. And lo and behold, even at Compass, I'm like, what do we do, and we had nothing in place. So I had to use my first two years are really just like researching developing content and information for us to put in place to support those clients. So even to your point, it wasn't intentional. But that never been considered a compass until it presented itself. Michael Hingson ** 58:33 We still do not recognize it. Inclusion should be part of the cost of doing business and part of the cost of life, which is really the issue. But yeah, you're right, there are so many limitations on people who are receiving benefits, like SSI and SSDI. There's only so much that can be done. And Congress isn't really willing to change that. So it is unfortunate that it did it continues to happen. Yeah, Dwayne Keys ** 59:01 I mean, even one of the blessings was the ABLE account, which was That was great. But you have to be aced what your disability had to have occurred on or before get 26 birth that right? I'm like, okay, so what happens if I'm 30 something years old? And it's something Oh, I can't use that. So still is excluding a segment of population who could benefit from that program? So Michael Hingson ** 59:23 there's a lot of that, oh, it's an very unfortunate situation. And we're not. We're not anywhere near dealing with any of that yet. You also have your own little enterprise outside of campus, right? Dwayne Keys ** 59:33 Yeah. So the key solution that you know, as I said, I've been doing a number of practical projects. I don't have any like formal business model. But what I in the past I've been asked to facilitate a meeting or lead a workshop or do this one on one, you know, business coaching. So there's a number of areas that I have outside of, of compass that I've worked on, like I said a lot of stuff in terms of just my expertise with planning A zoning committee engagement just thinks, you know, supporting Black and Brown business owners in terms of moving forward. And it was like, Well, why don't you start, you know, maybe doing that as a business. So long Behold, this past year, like I said, there's always every once in awhile, I will have a project where I was asked to do something, pieces, you know, you know, you know, some money, but nothing significant. This year, I had been sign up for a number of activities, as I said, like being a workshop, instructor, business coach, doing consistent, you know, activities, and I was like, Oh, this is gonna be different. And so I said, it's hypothetical, this is this is not going to be something I should file like, I should not, I should treat this as a business income that it is. And I had had the key solution already set up. And I was like, Okay, why don't you make this a regular thing? Why don't you put this out there that you do these activities at a price. And so that has been a whirlwind. But I've completed a catalyst Fellowship Program, which is a paid fellowship program to learn how to be a nonprofit consultant. There has been other particular things that I've done in terms of CES, like, there's one project we're doing is called Broad Street Stories. And I'm a community connector with supporting how you go to the engagement strategies with the community. You know, I get all paid work, things that I've done for volunteer basis, but be see getting compensated for the expertise in that arena. Michael Hingson ** 1:01:32 So you haven't written any books or anything? Have you? I have Dwayne Keys ** 1:01:35 not written? Oh, you gotta get some stuff. But no, it's Michael, it's been so busy trying to get all these activities just to sit down and be like, well, I need to write this all down. That has definitely been a challenge. Michael Hingson ** 1:01:47 Well, you have a lot of life experiences that I think would make a great story, a great book, that is something to think about in the future. And when you do you got to let us know, so we can help promote it. Absolutely, definitely will do. Well, Dwayne, I want to really thank you for being here with us today. This has been a lot of fun. I really love your insights and the things that you've had to say, if people want to reach out to you learn more about maybe deaky solutions, or just talk with you how can they do that? Let's Dwayne Keys ** 1:02:15 say the primary way is my LinkedIn. You know, Dwayne Keys, you never really see my face on air. Can I Can you spell that right? So Dwayne D w a y n e K e y s. Michael Hingson ** 1:02:30 So we can, as we did find you on LinkedIn, and other people can do that. And they're probably the best way to reach out to you. Dwayne Keys ** 1:02:38 Yes, I will say LinkedIn is the primary resource. Obviously, people can get in touch with me in terms of that primary vehicle. I am active on social media. So you know, some people also access me through Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, I'm on on those stops. I'm not on Snapchat or Tik Tok, but I am on our Facebook. Definitely. Michael Hingson ** 1:03:02 Cool. Well, Dwayne, thanks for being here. And I want to thank you all for listening to us today. This has been fun. And I think it's been educational. It's really neat to hear how somebody is really working to help make a social difference, and you can't do much better net. So we really appreciate you being here. And I want to thank you all again for listening to us. Reach out to Dwayne, I'm sure he'd love to hear from you. I'd love to hear from you. If you've got any thoughts, you can reach me at Michaelhi m i c h a e l h i at accessiBe A c c e s s i b e.com. You can reach our podcast page at WWW dot Michael hingson.com/podcast. And Michael Hingson is m i c h a el h i n g s o n. So Michael hingson.com/podcast. Please, wherever you're listening, give us a five star rating. By the way, if you're looking for a speaker to come and talk about trust and teamwork, and of course my September 11 story, if you know of anybody who needs a speaker to come and motivate or educate, talk about inclusion and so on, reach out to me at Michael h i at accessibe.com. I'd love to talk with you about coming to speak. And again, love those five star ratings. So thank you for those and we'll thank you in advance for doing that. But Dwayne one last time I want to really thank you for being here and for giving us your valuable time. And now we should probably let you go eat dinner. Thank Dwayne Keys ** 1:04:28 you so very much. Yes, I need to I need my string for all this work that way I get that. There Michael Hingson ** 1:04:33 you go. Well, really thank you for being here. We really appreciate it. Dwayne Keys ** 1:04:37 My pleasure. Thank you. Michael Hingson ** 1:04:44 You have been listening to the Unstoppable Mindset podcast. Thanks for dropping by. I hope that you'll join us again next week, and in future weeks for upcoming episodes. To subscribe to our podcast and to learn about upcoming episodes, please visit www dot Michael hingson.com slash podcast. Michael Hingson is spelled m i c h a e l h i n g s o n. While you're on the site., please use the form there to recommend people who we ought to interview in upcoming editions of the show. And also, we ask you and urge you to invite your friends to join us in the future. If you know of any one or any organization needing a speaker for an event, please email me at speaker at Michael hingson.com. I appreciate it very much. To learn more about the concept of blinded by fear, please visit www dot Michael hingson.com forward slash blinded by fear and while you're there, feel free to pick up a copy of my free eBook entitled blinded by fear. The unstoppable mindset podcast is provided by access cast an initiative of accessiBe and is sponsored by accessiBe. Please visit www.accessibe.com . AccessiBe is spelled a c c e s s i b e. There you can learn all about how you can make your website inclusive for all persons with disabilities and how you can help make the internet fully inclusive by 2025. Thanks again for Listening. Please come back and visit us again next week.