Nate Lawson II Security Cryptography Whatever podcast

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Apple has pulled the availability of their opt-in iCloud end-to-end encryption feature, called Advanced Data Protection, in the UK. This doesn't only affect UK Apple users, however. To help us make sense of this surprising move from the fruit company, we got Matt Green, Associate Professor at Johns Hopkins, and Joe Hall, Distinguished Technologist at the Internet Society, on the horn. Recorded Saturday February 22nd, 2025. Transcript: https://securitycryptographywhatever.com/2025/02/24/apple-pulls-adp-in-uk/ Watch episode on YouTube: https://youtu.be/LAn_yOGUkR0 Links: - https://www.lawfaremedia.org/article/apples-cloud-key-vault-and-secure-law-enforcement-access - https://www.androidcentral.com/how-googles-backup-encryption-works-good-bad-and-ugly - https://gdpr.eu/right-to-be-forgotten/ - https://www.legislation.gov.uk/id/ukpga/2024/9 - https://www.nytimes.com/2021/05/17/technology/apple-china-censorship-data.html - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salt_Typhoon - Salt Typhoon: https://www.cisa.gov/news-events/news/strengthening-americas-resilience-against-prc-cyber-threats - https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2025-02-21/apple-removes-end-to-end-encryption-feature-from-uk-after-backdoor-order - https://support.apple.com/en-us/102651 "Security Cryptography Whatever" is hosted by Deirdre Connolly (@durumcrustulum), Thomas Ptacek (@tqbf), and David Adrian (@davidcadrian)…

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Cryptanalyzing LLMs with Nicholas Carlini 1:20:42

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'Let us model our large language model as a hash function—' Sold. Our special guest Nicholas Carlini joins us to discuss differential cryptanalysis on LLMs and other attacks, just as the ones that made OpenAI turn off some features, hehehehe. Watch episode on YouTube: https://youtu.be/vZ64xPI2Rc0 Transcript: https://securitycryptographywhatever.com/2025/01/28/cryptanalyzing-llms-with-nicholas-carlini/ Links: - https://nicholas.carlini.com - “Stealing Part of a Production Language Model”: https://arxiv.org/pdf/2403.06634 - ‘Why I attack"’: https://nicholas.carlini.com/writing/2024/why-i-attack.html - “Cryptanalytic Extraction of Neural Network Models”, CRYPTO 2020: https://arxiv.org/abs/2003.04884 - “Stochastic Parrots”: https://dl.acm.org/doi/10.1145/3442188.3445922 - https://help.openai.com/en/articles/5247780-using-logit-bias-to-alter-token-probability-with-the-openai-api - https://community.openai.com/t/temperature-top-p-and-top-k-for-chatbot-responses/295542 - https://opensource.org/license/mit - https://github.com/madler/zlib - https://ai.meta.com/blog/yann-lecun-ai-model-i-jepa/ - https://nicholas.carlini.com/writing/2024/how-i-use-ai.html "Security Cryptography Whatever" is hosted by Deirdre Connolly (@durumcrustulum), Thomas Ptacek (@tqbf), and David Adrian (@davidcadrian)…

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Biden’s Cyber-Everything Bagel with Carole House 57:14

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Just a few days before turning off the lights, the Biden administration dropped a huge cybersecurity executive order including a lot of good stuff, that hopefully [cross your fingers, knock wood, spin around three times and spit] will last into future administrations. We snagged some time with Carole House, outgoing Special Advisor and Acting Senior Director for Cybersecurity and Critical Infrastructure Policy, National Security Council in the Biden-Harris White House, to give us a brain dump. And now due to popular demand, with video of our actual human¹ faces! https://youtu.be/Pqw0W2crQiM Transcript: https://securitycryptographywhatever.com/2025/01/20/bidens-cyber-everything-bagel-carole-house/ Links: - https://www.federalregister.gov/d/2025-01470 - https://www.wired.com/story/biden-executive-order-cybersecurity-ai-and-more/ - 2022 EO: https://archive.ph/hvzWd - 2023 EO: https://www.whitehouse.gov/wp-content/uploads/2023/06/M-23-16-Update-to-M-22-18-Enhancing-Software-Security-1.pdf - 2021 EO: https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2021/05/17/2021-10460/improving-the-nations-cybersecurity - NIST SSDF: https://nvlpubs.nist.gov/nistpubs/SpecialPublications/NIST.SP.800-218.pdf - https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2015/04/02/2015-07788/blocking-the-property-of-certain-persons-engaging-in-significant-malicious-cyber-enabled-activities - IEEPA: https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/USCODE-2023-title50/pdf/USCODE-2023-title50-chap35-sec1701.pdf ¹ Actual human faces not guaranteed in all cases "Security Cryptography Whatever" is hosted by Deirdre Connolly (@durumcrustulum), Thomas Ptacek (@tqbf), and David Adrian (@davidcadrian)…

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Quantum Willow with John Schanck and Samuel Jacques 53:36

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THE QUANTUM COMPUTERS ARE COMING...right? We got Samuel Jacques and John Schanck at short notice to answer that question plus a bunch of other about error correcting codes, logical qubits, T-gates, and more about Google's new quantum computer Willow. Transcript: https://securitycryptographywhatever.com/2024/12/18/quantum-willow Links: - https://blog.google/technology/research/google-willow-quantum-chip/ - https://research.google/blog/making-quantum-error-correction-work/ - https://blog.google/technology/google-deepmind/alphaqubit-quantum-error-correction/ - https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-024-08449-y - Sam’s ‘Landscape of Quantum Computing’ chart: https://sam-jaques.appspot.com/quantum\_landscape\_2024 - The above, originally published in 2021: https://sam-jaques.appspot.com/quantum\_landscape - https://sam-jaques.appspot.com - https://jmschanck.info/ "Security Cryptography Whatever" is hosted by Deirdre Connolly (@durumcrustulum), Thomas Ptacek (@tqbf), and David Adrian (@davidcadrian)…

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Dual_EC_DRBG with Justin Schuh and Matthew Green 1:07:45

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Nothing we have ever recorded on SCW has brought so much joy to David. However, at several points during the episode, we may have witnessed Matthew Green's soul leave his body. Our esteemed guests Justin Schuh and Matt Green joined us to debate whether `Dual_EC_DRBG` was intentionally backdoored by the NSA or 'just' a major fuckup. Transcript: https://securitycryptographywhatever.com/2024/12/07/dual-ec-drbg Links: - Dicky George at InfiltrateCon 2014, 'Life at Both Ends of the Barrel - An NSA Targeting Retrospective': [https://youtu.be/qq-LCyRp6bU?si=MyTBKomkIVaxSy1Q](https://youtu.be/qq-LCyRp6bU?si=MyTBKomkIVaxSy1Q) - Dicky George: [https://www.nsa.gov/Press-Room/Digital-Media-Center/Biographies/Biography-View-Page/Article/3330261/richard-dickie-george/](https://www.nsa.gov/Press-Room/Digital-Media-Center/Biographies/Biography-View-Page/Article/3330261/richard-dickie-george/) - NYTimes on Sigint Enabling Project: [https://archive.nytimes.com/www.nytimes.com/interactive/2013/09/05/us/documents-reveal-nsa-campaign-against-encryption.html](https://archive.nytimes.com/www.nytimes.com/interactive/2013/09/05/us/documents-reveal-nsa-campaign-against-encryption.html) - On the Practical Exploitability of Dual EC in TLS Implementations: [https://www.usenix.org/system/files/conference/usenixsecurity14/sec14-paper-checkoway.pdf](https://www.usenix.org/system/files/conference/usenixsecurity14/sec14-paper-checkoway.pdf) - Wired - Researchers Solve Juniper Backdoor Mystery; Signs Point to NSA [https://www.wired.com/2015/12/researchers-solve-the-juniper-mystery-and-they-say-its-partially-the-nsas-fault/](https://www.wired.com/2015/12/researchers-solve-the-juniper-mystery-and-they-say-its-partially-the-nsas-fault/) - ProPublica - Revealed: The NSA's Secret Campaign to Crack, Undermine Internet Security [https://www.propublica.org/article/the-nsas-secret-campaign-to-crack-undermine-internet-encryption](https://www.propublica.org/article/the-nsas-secret-campaign-to-crack-undermine-internet-encryption) - DDoSecrets - Sigint Enabling Project: [https://data.ddosecrets.com/Snowden%20archive/sigint-enabling-project.pdf](https://data.ddosecrets.com/Snowden%20archive/sigint-enabling-project.pdf) - IAD: [https://www.iad.gov/](https://www.iad.gov/) - Ars Technica - “Unauthorized code” in Juniper firewalls decrypts encrypted VPN traffic: [https://web.archive.org/web/20151222023311/http://arstechnica.com/security/2015/12/unauthorized-code-in-juniper-firewalls-decrypts-encrypted-vpn-traffic/](https://web.archive.org/web/20151222023311/http://arstechnica.com/security/2015/12/unauthorized-code-in-juniper-firewalls-decrypts-encrypted-vpn-traffic/) - 2015 IMPORTANT JUNIPER SECURITY ANNOUNCEMENT: [https://web.archive.org/web/20151221171526/http://forums.juniper.net/t5/Security-Incident-Response/Important-Announcement-about-ScreenOS/ba-p/285554](https://web.archive.org/web/20151221171526/http://forums.juniper.net/t5/Security-Incident-Response/Important-Announcement-about-ScreenOS/ba-p/285554) - Extended Random Values for TLS: [https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-rescorla-tls-extended-random-00](https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-rescorla-tls-extended-random-00) - The Art of Software Security Assessment: [https://www.amazon.com/Art-Software-Security-Assessment-Vulnerabilities/dp/0321444426](https://www.amazon.com/Art-Software-Security-Assessment-Vulnerabilities/dp/0321444426) "Security Cryptography Whatever" is hosted by Deirdre Connolly (@durumcrustulum), Thomas Ptacek (@tqbf), and David Adrian (@davidcadrian)…

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A Little Bit of Rust Goes a Long Way with Android's Jeff Vander Stoep 1:13:55

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You may not be rewriting the world in Rust, but if you follow the findings of the Android team and our guest Jeff Vander Stoep, you'll drive down your memory-unsafety vulnerabilities more than 2X below the industry average over time! 🎉 Transcript: https://securitycryptographywhatever.com/2024/10/15/a-little-bit-of-rust-goes-a-long-way/ Links: - https://security.googleblog.com/2024/09/eliminating-memory-safety-vulnerabilities-Android.html - “Safe Coding”: https://dl.acm.org/doi/10.1145/3651621 - “effectiveness of security design”: https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/16LZ6T-tcjgp3T8_N3m0pa5kNA1DwIsuMcQYDhpMU7uU/edit#slide=id.g3e7cac054a_0_89 - https://security.googleblog.com/2024/02/improving-interoperability-between-rust-and-c.html - https://github.com/google/crubit - https://github.com/google/autocxx - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stagefright_(bug) - https://security.googleblog.com/2021/04/rust-in-android-platform.html - https://chromium.googlesource.com/chromium/src/+/master/docs/security/rule-of-2.md - https://www.usenix.org/conference/usenixsecurity22/presentation/alexopoulos -https://kb.meinbergglobal.com/kb/time_sync/ntp/ntp_vulnerabilities_reported_2023-04 - https://blog.isosceles.com/the-legacy-of-stagefright/ - https://research.google/pubs/secure-by-design-googles-perspective-on-memory-safety/ - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QrrH2lcl9ew - https://source.android.com/docs/setup/build/rust/building-rust-modules/overview - https://github.com/rust-lang/rust-bindgen - https://security.googleblog.com/2021/06/rustc-interop-in-android-platform.html "Security Cryptography Whatever" is hosted by Deirdre Connolly (@durumcrustulum), Thomas Ptacek (@tqbf), and David Adrian (@davidcadrian)…

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Campaign Security with [REDACTED] 1:23:39

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1:23:39

With the 2024 United States Presidential Election right around the corner, we talk to an unnamed guest who has worked on cybersecurity for political campaigns in the United States since 2004. We recorded this in late August, 2024. Transcript: https://securitycryptographywhatever.com/2024/10/13/campaign-security/ Links: - Active Measures by Thomas Rind: https://us.macmillan.com/books/9780374287269/activemeasures - Aurora: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation\_Aurora - Google APP announcement, October 2017: https://www.wired.com/story/google-advanced-protection-locks-down-accounts/ - XXD: https://linux.die.net/man/1/xxd - Adobe Reader October 2016 Security Update: https://helpx.adobe.com/security/products/acrobat/apsb16-33.html "Security Cryptography Whatever" is hosted by Deirdre Connolly (@durumcrustulum), Thomas Ptacek (@tqbf), and David Adrian (@davidcadrian)…

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Telegram with Matthew Green 1:04:04

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1:04:04

We finally have an excuse to tear down Telegram! Their CEO got arrested by the French, apparently not because the cryptography in Telegram is bad, but special guest Matt Green joined us to talk about how the cryptography is bad anyway, and you probably shouldn't use Telegram as a secure messenger of any kind! Transcript: https://securitycryptographywhatever.com/2024/09/06/telegram Links: - https://blog.cryptographyengineering.com/2024/08/25/telegram-is-not-really-an-encrypted-messaging-app/ - Lavabit / Ladar Levinson: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lavabit - Pavel Durov indictment statement from French authorities: https://www.tribunal-de-paris.justice.fr/sites/default/files/2024-08/2024-08-28%20-%20CP%20TELEGRAM%20mise%20en%20examen.pdf - MTProto 2.0 protocol spec: https://core.telegram.org/api/end-to-end - https://words.filippo.io/dispatches/telegram-ecdh/ - MTProto 1.0 (old no longer used): - https://web.archive.org/web/20131220000537/https://core.telegram.org/api/end-to-end#key-generation - OTR: https://otr.cypherpunks.ca/otr-wpes.pdf - AES and sha2 used in ‘Infinite Garble Extension’ mode: https://eprint.iacr.org/2015/1177.pdf - Four Attacks and a Proof for Telegram: https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/stamp/stamp.jsp?tp=&arnumber=9833666 - History of Telegram e2ee chats availability: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telegram_(software)#Architecture - https://securitycryptographywhatever.com/2023/01/27/threema/ - https://securitycryptographywhatever.com/2022/11/02/Matrix-with-Martin-Albrecht-Dan-Jones/ - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matrix_(protocol), introduced in September 2014 "Security Cryptography Whatever" is hosted by Deirdre Connolly (@durumcrustulum), Thomas Ptacek (@tqbf), and David Adrian (@davidcadrian)…

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Summertime Sadness 57:26

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57:26

Are you going to be in Vegas during BlackHat / DEF CON? We're hosting a mixer, sponsored by Observa ! We have limited capacity, so please only register if you can actually come. Location details are in the confirmation email. Tickets will be released in batches, so if you get waitlisted, there's a good chance you still get in. Looking forward to seeing you in Vegas! Ticket Link: https://www.eventbrite.com/e/scwpod-vegas-2024-tickets-946939099337 We talk about CrowdStrike in this episode, but we know we made some mistakes: The sys files may be code in addition to data. The bug might be bigger than "just" a null pointer exception. Luckily, none of that is actually relevant to the main issues we discuss. Show page: https://securitycryptographywhatever.com/2024/07/24/summertime-sadness/ Other Links: https://csrc.nist.gov/projects/post-quantum-cryptography/post-quantum-cryptography-standardization https://dadrian.io/blog/posts/pqc-signatures-2024/ https://dadrian.io/blog/posts/cto/ https://www.blackhat.com/us-24/briefings/schedule/ https://terrapin-attack.com/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-AqayGm0_pw More like ClownStrike, amirite? "Security Cryptography Whatever" is hosted by Deirdre Connolly (@durumcrustulum), Thomas Ptacek (@tqbf), and David Adrian (@davidcadrian)…

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Zero Day Markets with Mark Dowd 1:25:49

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1:25:49

We have Mark Dowd on, founder of Aziumuth Security and one of the authors of The Art of Software Security Assessment, to talk about the market for zero day vulnerabilities, and how mitigations affect monetizing offensive security work. Transcript: https://securitycryptographywhatever.com/2024/06/24/mdowd/ Links: https://www.azimuthsecurity.com/ https://www.vigilantlabs.com/ https://github.com/mdowd79/presentations/blob/main/bluehat2023-mdowd-final.pdf https://i.blackhat.com/USA21/Wednesday-Handouts/us-21-Hack-Different-Pwning-IOS-14-With-Generation-Z-Bug-wp.pdf https://i.blackhat.com/USA-19/Wednesday/us-19-Shwartz-Selling-0-Days-To-Governments-And-Offensive-Security-Companies.pdf "Security Cryptography Whatever" is hosted by Deirdre Connolly (@durumcrustulum), Thomas Ptacek (@tqbf), and David Adrian (@davidcadrian)…

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ekr 1:48:16

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1:48:16

iykyk Transcript: https://securitycryptographywhatever.com/2024/05/25/ekr/ Links: - https://hovav.net/ucsd/dist/draft-shacham-tls-fasttrack-00.txt - https://crypto.stanford.edu/~dabo/pubs/papers/fasttrack.pdf - https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/rfc8446 - SoK: SCT Auditing in Certificate Transparency: https://arxiv.org/pdf/2203.01661 - A hard look at Certificate Transparency, Part I: Transparency Systems: https://educatedguesswork.org/posts/transparency-part-1/ - A hard look at Certificate Transparency: CT in Reality: https://educatedguesswork.org/posts/transparency-part-2/ - E2EE on the web: is the web really that bad? https://emilymstark.com/2024/02/09/e2ee-on-the-web-is-the-web-really-that-bad.html - Launching Default End-to-End Encryption on Messenger: https://about.fb.com/news/2023/12/default-end-to-end-encryption-on-messenger/ - ekr's newsletter: https://educatedguesswork.org - Over 25 years of ekr RFCs: https://www.rfc-editor.org/search/rfc_search_detail.php?sortkey=Date&sorting=DESC&page=All&author=rescorla&pubstatus[]=Any&pub_date_type=any Subscribe to his newsletter at https://educatedguesswork.org/ "Security Cryptography Whatever" is hosted by Deirdre Connolly (@durumcrustulum), Thomas Ptacek (@tqbf), and David Adrian (@davidcadrian)…

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STIR/SHAKEN with Paul Grubbs and Josh Brown 1:01:47

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Josh Brown and Paul Grubbs join us to describe how those damned spam calls work, and how STIR/SHAKEN is supposed to try to stop them, but have other privacy and security implications as well. Transcript: https://securitycryptographywhatever.com/2024/04/30/stir-shaken/ Links: - https://iacr.org/submit/files/slides/2024/rwc/rwc2024/98/slides.pdf - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3trxXF0-fRU - Paul Grubbs: https://web.eecs.umich.edu/~paulgrub/ "Security Cryptography Whatever" is hosted by Deirdre Connolly (@durumcrustulum), Thomas Ptacek (@tqbf), and David Adrian (@davidcadrian)…

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Cryptography Tier List 19:28

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(NSFW) Three AI-generated guests rank cryptography things into a tier list. Play along at home and make your own tier list: https://tiermaker.com/create/cryptography-15683166 This episode is definitely not safe for work and definitely a parody. Do not base your decision in the 2024 election off of this podcast episode. No campaigns have endorsed this podcast. "Security Cryptography Whatever" is hosted by Deirdre Connolly (@durumcrustulum), Thomas Ptacek (@tqbf), and David Adrian (@davidcadrian)…

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Post-Quantum iMessage with Douglas Stebila 55:34

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Apple iMessage is getting a big upgrade! Not only are they rolling out ratcheting, but they’re going post-quantum, AND they’re doing post-quantum ratcheting! Douglas Stebila joined us to talk about his security analysis of the new PQ3 protocol update and not indulge our wild Apple speculations: Transcript: https://securitycryptographywhatever.com/2024/03/03/post-quantum-imessage-with-douglas-stebila/ Links: - https://security.apple.com/blog/imessage-pq3/ - Security analysis of the iMessage PQ3 protocol https://security.apple.com/assets/files/A_Formal_Analysis_of_the_iMessage_PQ3_Messaging_Protocol_Basin_et_al.pdf - Ratcheting design: https://eprint.iacr.org/2024/220.pdf - When Messages are Keys: Is HMAC a dual-PRF?: https://eprint.iacr.org/2023/861.pdf - Real World Deniability in Messaging: https://eprint.iacr.org/2023/403.pdf - Padmé: https://www.petsymposium.org/2019/files/papers/issue4/popets-2019-0056.pdf - Max Headroom: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYdpOjletnc - Extended Canetti-Krawczyk model: https://iacr.org/archive/eurocrypt2001/20450451.pdf - Douglas Stebila: https://www.douglas.stebila.ca/ "Security Cryptography Whatever" is hosted by Deirdre Connolly (@durumcrustulum), Thomas Ptacek (@tqbf), and David Adrian (@davidcadrian)…

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High-assurance Post-Quantum Crypto with Franziskus Kiefer and Karthik Bhargavan 56:13

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